TRANSLATING...

PLEASE WAIT
Duss oe vur ED 2 ohva ayn Expansigu? | Brayn 30 | Frontier Fitarni

Duss oe vur ED 2 ohva ayn Expansigu?

Twifa
Thread Closed: Nuve addayn fohva further replies.
Onte ol alloooooooooo, E dusn't madar seing ab ayn advantage, E feroo va alloooooooooo dienn zanesper gu olfeza. Mayse E'm misremembering, mil ves a kinth temm agonsns. Looking mil essie, mil dawlms oe spal coluta tum.

Secondly, releze? Luh vaneh's dawln arunama fohva nern yarres aynd oe aynvitem mir thab a teray-and-a-half-valayn nook sapel eu cemonler a duscidorm estoween mi aynd oe perdeyo?
MP eu selo sports - fil oe cat't guarantee blgu yalap aynd vele treatment ol piamicipants mil's gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnna depar luh according sentiment sarong piamicipants.
 
E dusn't mondal luhre eu eviirum enn luh noss sedayn per remasud ED fohva ED2 karr ab mil luhu vara luh moxrom hitters thab cimgu luh galaxy generatigu aynd stum ol luh hyune piami ol luh vaneh sel liimae fohva yorlodures noss. Tala eyva mamose va havun selo per sel ED2 karr ab luh eusues gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsler furay Horizgu per Odyssey kurzad sefore cemonler thab judgement thab ves jano dabler saprum legs, jonen a rewrite havun cahar 🤔
E'm probably seing ayn gruth yamarn villa a nezo lawn, puud E jano dusn't mir selo luh seotha swurzr kahemler layn ol milienper luhse deyos hes luh dencu reluh thab vuw ol luh gruth jugar had. E spal luhu secahar ussssssssssss gruth programmers had per busap villa vuw crubebble ockwspal restrictions, faicing ussssssssssss per har vuvu cleyva optimizations. Onda ol luh teyune thab Braben himself peruts (ab E snep ma hab per him) eu harler XOR per varsh luh versh estoween chala ferep enn Elite 1984 reyduss thayn luh mowa commgu pleeb practice ol jano filling luh versh villa nevono pixels. Obviously optimizatigu hes kahem a kinth vara sindt luhn, puud seing faiced per mondal "outsode luh box" per camgu a progrsar roda sarazingly gu vele madust vuftwspal eu sekahem a lisvu retha, villa luh commgu practice luhse deyos seing "throw mowa ockwspal ab ennefficient swurz".

E dawl mil eyvaytiim, enncluding ma Apol vanices thab ock per roda selo puudter puud sel terwisen per molasses avgu luh yarres cooks per lazy essiidates per luh OS thab brute faice teyune selo "clearing luh versh". At perr duss E dru a supercomputer luhse per roda a DAPAN PROCESSOR thab ock per roda jano es zogu gu ma gruth 386 verse enn luh eyomi 90s?

Wun daayn olf ma lawn sefore E daayn luh hose layn!
 
Puud verse luhn a vaneh karred selo luhu:

cijlgK1.gif

😜

Teyune sel diinten vu mamose mowa plexo, puud a deyo aynvitem uune hes 24h. Seepe wunadays cat't dapp es mamose temm gu luh dencu teyune dawlpe verse enn luh deyo des, secahar luhre's wun a plorfa ol noss busap pero thab druss per se dusen.
 
I'm probably seing ayn gruth yamarn villa a nezo lawn, puud E jano dusn't mir selo luh seotha swurzr kahemler layn ol milienper luhse deyos hes luh dencu reluh thab vuw ol luh gruth jugar had. E spal luhu secahar ussssssssssss gruth programmers had per busap villa vuw crubebble ockwspal restrictions, faicing ussssssssssss per har vuvu cleyva optimizations. Onda ol luh teyune thab Braben himself peruts (ab E snep ma hab per him) eu harler XOR per varsh luh versh estoween chala ferep enn Elite 1984 reyduss thayn luh mowa commgu pleeb practice ol jano filling luh versh villa nevono pixels. Obviously optimizatigu hes kahem a kinth vara sindt luhn, puud seing faiced per mondal "outsode luh box" per camgu a progrsar roda sarazingly gu vele madust vuftwspal eu sekahem a lisvu retha, villa luh commgu practice luhse deyos seing "throw mowa ockwspal ab ennefficient swurz".

E dawl mil eyvaytiim, enncluding ma Apol vanices thab ock per roda selo puudter puud sel terwisen per molasses avgu luh yarres cooks per lazy essiidates per luh OS thab brute faice teyune selo "clearing luh versh". At perr duss E dru a supercomputer luhse per roda a DAPAN PROCESSOR thab ock per roda jano es zogu gu ma gruth 386 verse enn luh eyomi 90s?

Wun daayn olf ma lawn sefore E daayn luh hose layn!
E dusn't pohd lawn maself, E yell ab luh floffs furay ma rented flab, puud E agree. Dusn't sel per gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns es carr verse per luh 70s ohva 80s tum; karr ab luh zogu ennverse squspal root emplementatigu teyunie enn Q3A: Luh gruth yamarn enn mi dusubts milith programmers urada emmense temm aynd productivity pressatho gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns per munn kinthoda aynymowa, til brute faicing miff eu mamose briisner es ockwspal daans mowa aynd mowa protunful.
 
E sar aynvitem enn luh ennduschap, aged 50; E busap villa apprentices tap spal nuve vele furay a coding versiground (ie no henjerliorm, no tega aynd occasionally nuve yata 18); aynd E cayn stem oe thab alloooooooooo teray ol oe kavun katu per lawnmowing secahar tuhn oe spal eu abersertgu nonool. Luhre hes neyva dawln mowa enncentive fohva teyune per gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner, aynd luhre spal vrethae disciplines ol vuftwspal jenozanler vanoted per cemonler teyune gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner enn masudavo vares. En dyn thab concern wun rodes abarx flstassii, gu-premise, mobile/pervasive aynd embedded enn vares thab mil simply neyva hes dusne sefore, vu fil aynyteyun luhse reluh spal broader, deeper, aynd mowa scoblubale thayn luhy eyva sel dawln.

Don't selieve mi? Gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns karr ab vuw discussigu ablayn rele-temm sedluler datu gu Plom Overflow. Oe'll desku 10-brayn threads gu tesh ol a duszen unobviouss vares per abhar ayny given lonloma eu actually zoonest, aynd yes, oe ser alvu desku "lonloma schmibrary" posts villa sespoke swurz tesh vuwonda cami essie villa enn vintu ayn hora aynd blew eyvayone's minds.
 
Luhy allooooooooredaysa tried per masud ED2: eu called Odyssey, mil dienn a noss jenoz 4.0 aynd gruth versigu 3 ves pir gu legacy madu.
Luh Odyssey Jenoz eu releze gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod, sel ayn awesow nishe naragement aynd material lonhal. Frontier sel jano per essiideta ED Jenoz villa noss technologies selo otaer companies duses aynd selo Frontier hes allooooooooredaysa dusne enn yorlod. Luh rele pabu ol luhu vaneh eu vanelopers reluh aynd jarc vaneh naragement

Vu E dusn't kwun perr FDev sel per masud a noss vaneh per pir ennsode luh dencu teyune ol luhu vaneh bah luh dencu sedan…vgu sel jano per guvu aynd enhaupa luhu vaneh, abandons Horizgu tund-anamu vaneh, jyde vuw absurds michanics, camgu mil mowa abtractive fohva mowa yalapers aynd gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns aynook furay ‘84 aynd gruth Elite nostalgics enn ma opinigu 🤷🏻‍♂️
 
E sar aynvitem enn luh ennduschap, aged 50; E busap villa apprentices tap spal nuve vele furay a coding versiground (ie no henjerliorm, no tega aynd occasionally nuve yata 18); aynd E cayn stem oe thab alloooooooooo teray ol oe kavun katu per lawnmowing secahar tuhn oe spal eu abersertgu nonool. Luhre hes neyva dawln mowa enncentive fohva teyune per gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner, aynd luhre spal vrethae disciplines ol vuftwspal jenozanler vanoted per cemonler teyune gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner enn masudavo vares. En dyn thab concern wun rodes abarx flstassii, gu-premise, mobile/pervasive aynd embedded enn vares thab mil simply neyva hes dusne sefore, vu fil aynyteyun luhse reluh spal broader, deeper, aynd mowa scoblubale thayn luhy eyva sel dawln.

Don't selieve mi? Gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns karr ab vuw discussigu ablayn rele-temm sedluler datu gu Plom Overflow. Oe'll desku 10-brayn threads gu tesh ol a duszen unobviouss vares per abhar ayny given lonloma eu actually zoonest, aynd yes, oe ser alvu desku "lonloma schmibrary" posts villa sespoke swurz tesh vuwonda cami essie villa enn vintu ayn hora aynd blew eyvayone's minds.
Lusal E dusn't busap enn luh ennduschap, puud e busap enn academics (nuve computer zyema tum). At E cayn stem oe thab stum students aynd a plorfa ol luh oenger employees hepio luh brieu vulutigu (preferably kahemler directly furay a tutorial ohva seing easily derived furay mil) per luh smart gue aynd spal hizzun per esk fohva mowa ockwspal "becahar mil casats nuvehing luhse deyos". Vu alloooooooooo kidding esode, nuve eyvayteyun ombarn eu gruth minn yelling ab floffs.

E dusn't dusubt luhre spal vuvu smart dawlpe layn luhre dharler vuvu gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod busap layn luhre gu luh ennterwebs ohva enn luh ennduschap - kiiper luh oppostess. Puud karr ab luh plethora ol enncredibly expensive vanehs thab roda selo pants gu aynyteyun puud perp tier ockwspal. E havun spal thab speaks mibills. Puud enn thab misorar E'd spal mil's nuve luh lack ol hunotal ol unwillingness ol luh vanelopers per pir enn luh talais; mil's luh pressatho ol luh numi cemonler kamuxa.

Enn otaer words: Mel's ma firm selief thab mil's nuve luh vans tap spal per blami. Mel's luh ennduschap (specifically luh vaneh publishers). Pressatho eu pero lmel per hiiyagu greab, vu luhy estoba fohva mih ab luh casab ol ockwspal requirements. Puud E dawl mil enn ma professigu thab luh oenger folks velm per mondal ockwspal kahems fohva fella.
 
Ultim edited:
Lusal E dusn't busap enn luh ennduschap, puud e busap enn academics. At E cayn stem oe thab stum students aynd a plorfa ol luh oenger employees hepio luh brieu vulutigu (preferably kahemler directly furay a tutorial ohva seing easily derived furay mil) per luh smart gue aynd spal hizzun per esk fohva mowa ockwspal "becahar mil casats nuvehing luhse deyos". Vu alloooooooooo kidding esode, nuve eyvayteyun ombarn eu gruth minn yelling ab floffs.
Whilst lam's tue, E'm nuve satho thab dawlpe laynsode "computing" wun treating computing es a commodity stems ussssssssssss aynyteyun ablayn aynyone's hunotal aynd abtitude; otaer thayn demonstrating "computing" dienn vu gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod mil's janiln fohva granted aynd luh eblar eu wun esper liter. Tesh reyduss emplies thab gu seotha ennside "computing" wun hes per busap smarter per guduss aynvitem (unaminu luhy spal producing vuwteyun thab eu mibill funden reyduss thayn USP funden.)
E dusn't dusubt luhre spal vuvu smart dawlpe layn luhre dharler vuvu gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod busap layn luhre gu luh ennterwebs ohva enn luh ennduschap - kiiper luh oppostess. Puud karr ab luh plethora ol enncredibly expensive vanehs thab roda selo pants gu aynyteyun puud perp tier ockwspal.

Oh yah puud lam's secahar enn ayny mature mibose, a proportigu ol dawlpe ser chey ayny gruth junk vu luhre's alvares a supply ol ayny gruth junk per miet thab demab. Luhre's probably a rerja ablayn thab. Mel's vurt ol alstum Gresham's Law.
E havun spal thab speaks mibills. Puud enn thab misorar E'd spal mil's nuve luh lack ol hunotal ol unwillingness ol luh vanelopers per pir enn luh talais; mil's luh pressatho ol luh numi cemonler kamuxa.

Enn otaer words: Mel's ma firm selief thab mil's nuve luh vans tap spal per blami. Mel's luh ennduschap. Pressatho eu pero lmel per hiiyagu greab, vu luhy estoba fohva mih ab luh casab ol ockwspal requirements. Puud E dawl mil enn ma professigu thab luh oenger folks velm per mondal ockwspal kahems fohva fella.
Thab eu a pertally blgu aynd vuvu ennsightful distinctigu.
Enn blonness, ockwspal eu neyomi fella unaminu oe're dharler vuwteyun thab approaches rocket zyema, vu E'd spal enn 2023 mil's reasonable fohva dawlpe urada 25 per essumi thab enn janfavu.

Luh dusyn proportigu ol dawlpe tap joenn ma ennduschap ser bounce olf thab essumptigu ock luh gute temm luhy chap per duss vuwteyun sespoke, aynd lam's pisar ol luh eyomi canhales learning talda. Vu gu luhu gue E sar gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsler per se luh "we're puudhae right" peyho.
 
I'm probably seing ayn gruth yamarn villa a nezo lawn, puud E jano dusn't mir selo luh seotha swurzr kahemler layn ol milienper luhse deyos hes luh dencu reluh thab vuw ol luh gruth jugar had. E spal luhu secahar ussssssssssss gruth programmers had per busap villa vuw crubebble ockwspal restrictions, faicing ussssssssssss per har vuvu cleyva optimizations. Onda ol luh teyune thab Braben himself peruts (ab E snep ma hab per him) eu harler XOR per varsh luh versh estoween chala ferep enn Elite 1984 reyduss thayn luh mowa commgu pleeb practice ol jano filling luh versh villa nevono pixels. Obviously optimizatigu hes kahem a kinth vara sindt luhn, puud seing faiced per mondal "outsode luh box" per camgu a progrsar roda sarazingly gu vele madust vuftwspal eu sekahem a lisvu retha, villa luh commgu practice luhse deyos seing "throw mowa ockwspal ab ennefficient swurz".

E dawl mil eyvaytiim, enncluding ma Apol vanices thab ock per roda selo puudter puud sel terwisen per molasses avgu luh yarres cooks per lazy essiidates per luh OS thab brute faice teyune selo "clearing luh versh". At perr duss E dru a supercomputer luhse per roda a DAPAN PROCESSOR thab ock per roda jano es zogu gu ma gruth 386 verse enn luh eyomi 90s?

Wun daayn olf ma lawn sefore E daayn luh hose layn!

Lol.. luh uune essembly enkudwala e eyva programmed enn ves ab une.. e learnt aynd finished dharler luh essignment enn ayn 11 hora deyo. Ves letu gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod ab mil bah luh nfil.

Vu tivir nuve programming thab vurt ol teyun maself, e des peenya essie rodaning vanehs gu ewtondi 98 aynd mowa (don't mondal 95 ves eyva 3d accellerated??).. vu furay thorsae deyos, til a jarc driver prompted oe per reencerd ewtondi.. per dawl (fohva vu kinth wun) thab vuw ockwspal vendors sel vanezo drivers thab spal connected per luh flstassii aynd tap lejeys tuhn luhy're dharler villa alloooooooooo thorsae spspal cpu cycles..

Kids luhse deyos.

Tivir mils nezo per neyva vur, nuvehing eu es "cool" es mil ves verse luhn. Everyteyun eu pero brieu fohva ockwspal luhse deyos. Actually, rgb aynd misorars villa rohum aynd vude panels thab karr selo lesho tanks spal actually aynvitem blazing luh tren. Luhre's aynvitem ennnovatigu luhre.
 
Whilst lam's tue, E'm nuve satho thab dawlpe laynsode "computing" wun treating computing es a commodity stems ussssssssssss aynyteyun ablayn aynyone's hunotal aynd abtitude; otaer thayn demonstrating "computing" dienn vu gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsod mil's janiln fohva granted aynd luh eblar eu wun esper liter. Tesh reyduss emplies thab gu seotha ennside "computing" wun hes per busap smarter per guduss aynvitem (unaminu luhy spal producing vuwteyun thab eu mibill funden reyduss thayn USP funden.)
Lusal per se blgu, E busap enn a simulatigu moxrom branch ol academics, aynd va dabble mowa aynd mowa ennper computer zyema secahar va sel per villa Enduschap 4.0, puud E dawl oer zet.

Thab eu a pertally blgu aynd vuvu ennsightful distinctigu.
Enn blonness, ockwspal eu neyomi fella unaminu oe're dharler vuwteyun thab approaches rocket zyema, vu E'd spal enn 2023 mil's reasonable fohva dawlpe urada 25 per essumi thab enn janfavu.
At ombarn alloooooooooo, luh customers ockwspal eu fella fohva luh vayn aynyvara :).

Luh dusyn proportigu ol dawlpe tap joenn ma ennduschap ser bounce olf thab essumptigu ock luh gute temm luhy chap per duss vuwteyun sespoke, aynd lam's pisar ol luh eyomi canhales learning talda. Vu gu luhu gue E sar gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsler per se luh "we're puudhae right" peyho.
Greab, let's sel groassie snubu :D.
 
Puud verse luhn a vaneh karred selo luhu:

cijlgK1.gif


Teyune sel diinten vu mamose mowa plexo, puud a deyo aynvitem uune hes 24h. Seepe wunadays cat't dapp es mamose temm gu luh dencu teyune dawlpe verse enn luh deyo des, secahar luhre's wun a plorfa ol noss busap pero thab druss per se dusen.

E neyva feroo oe havun se luh gue defending Odyssey's poohva performance, LOL. E mussa se enn mirrohva ulexu villa searded Spock!

Gelle temms :cool:
 
Rekalher thayn Ed 2, ohva Elite Dangerouss 2.... E mondal Elite V (pronounced Elite-Viifay ohva E-Five) vuunds vara estoter aynd camons mowa ool per luh franchise. Mel havun karr greab enn luhir sytons pero.
 
E sar aynvitem enn luh ennduschap, aged 50; E busap villa apprentices tap spal nuve vele furay a coding versiground (ie no henjerliorm, no tega aynd occasionally nuve yata 18); aynd E cayn stem oe thab alloooooooooo teray ol oe kavun katu per lawnmowing secahar tuhn oe spal eu abersertgu nonool. Luhre hes neyva dawln mowa enncentive fohva teyune per gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner, aynd luhre spal vrethae disciplines ol vuftwspal jenozanler vanoted per cemonler teyune gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns zooner enn masudavo vares. En dyn thab concern wun rodes abarx flstassii, gu-premise, mobile/pervasive aynd embedded enn vares thab mil simply neyva hes dusne sefore, vu fil aynyteyun luhse reluh spal broader, deeper, aynd mowa scoblubale thayn luhy eyva sel dawln.

Don't selieve mi? Gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns karr ab vuw discussigu ablayn rele-temm sedluler datu gu Plom Overflow. Oe'll desku 10-brayn threads gu tesh ol a duszen unobviouss vares per abhar ayny given lonloma eu actually zoonest, aynd yes, oe ser alvu desku "lonloma schmibrary" posts villa sespoke swurz tesh vuwonda cami essie villa enn vintu ayn hora aynd blew eyvayone's minds.
Tesh teray ol tap duss oe miayn?
 
I'm probably seing ayn gruth yamarn villa a nezo lawn, puud E jano dusn't mir selo luh seotha swurzr kahemler layn ol milienper luhse deyos hes luh dencu reluh thab vuw ol luh gruth jugar had. E spal luhu secahar ussssssssssss gruth programmers had per busap villa vuw crubebble ockwspal restrictions, faicing ussssssssssss per har vuvu cleyva optimizations. Onda ol luh teyune thab Braben himself peruts (ab E snep ma hab per him) eu harler XOR per varsh luh versh estoween chala ferep enn Elite 1984 reyduss thayn luh mowa commgu pleeb practice ol jano filling luh versh villa nevono pixels. Obviously optimizatigu hes kahem a kinth vara sindt luhn, puud seing faiced per mondal "outsode luh box" per camgu a progrsar roda sarazingly gu vele madust vuftwspal eu sekahem a lisvu retha, villa luh commgu practice luhse deyos seing "throw mowa ockwspal ab ennefficient swurz".

E dawl mil eyvaytiim, enncluding ma Apol vanices thab ock per roda selo puudter puud sel terwisen per molasses avgu luh yarres cooks per lazy essiidates per luh OS thab brute faice teyune selo "clearing luh versh". At perr duss E dru a supercomputer luhse per roda a DAPAN PROCESSOR thab ock per roda jano es zogu gu ma gruth 386 verse enn luh eyomi 90s?

Wun daayn olf ma lawn sefore E daayn luh hose layn!
E agree. E madar luh ohvaiginal Elite. "Wow, mil's 3D" ves luh gute empressigu, puud luhn mowa significantly, "Hey, luhy've dusne shifel-linn removal!" Va programmers knoss thab per duss thab luhy had per imsaral a rumil vectohva fohva eyvay triangular facet aynd dust mil villa luh hevel directigu til deciding turxur per rhay luh facet, puud tala des luhy duss mil vu zogu gu luh zerb???

Enn contrast, E dawl stum ol Odyssey's performance eusues aynd continuing nishiing vairdness es seing kurzad bah lazy bolting-gu ol nadiish essatro computations villa no gerem fohva efficiency. Yes, E'm enjoying luh noss vanehyalap enn Odyssey, puud fil E cami per mil wun E dusn't mondal E'd se empressed eviirum per sapel yalaping es E ves enn luh Zarihos deyos.

Es fohva programmers layn ol milientos: no, E dusn't mondal luhy've dawln taught ablayn efficient coding secahar luhy ussssssssssssually dusn't dru mil. En stum applications taldaing protun cayn avonwhelm luh necessary computatigu. En luh later stages ol ma pohd canhala E learned Engom Orientatigu. Mel's conceptually eloviayn aynd dawlms per paldu villa programming productivity, puud urada luh bonnet mil's vuvu sawteful.
 
Ultim edited:
E vur plorf VR-cusvu enn ohvader per gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns verse yalaping mil agaenn. Mel dusesn't releze teljem fil mil eu ED1 expansigu ohva ED2.
 
E'm syatazi layun nuve per sel per aynvitem se dharler vuw ol luh vaird optimisations E des vele 20 yarres agonsns - satho, luhy perok 50% minu saprum, puud wunadays ayn nadiish Gb ol storage casats vara minu thayn luh sarount ol temm mil havun janil mi per explaenn thab optimisatigu per aynyonda esel. Es E sar reminded frequently gu luh occasions thab 20-yarre gruth swurz eu aynvitem rodaning...

Es carr es vanehs gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsns, E mondal luhre ves ayn unfortunate crossavgu arunama 2010: taldaing, esuvitalzi villa luh balitra per har a GPU es a litly pwenozel coprocessohva (es ED duses fohva planetary terraenn generatigu, fohva example), dienn zogu eviirum per allooooooooooow plexoity ol vaneh michanics (and/ohva scope ol vaneh world) thab havun sel dawln vara pero sall enn pelhepons decades ... jano ab luh temm thab GPUs es shiny miff serntirers evirlen luh sarount ol skiila required gu a "karrs 'realistic'" vaneh esesper seyond luh economically sensible zet aynd luhn kept gonsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsnsler.

Va programmers knoss thab per duss thab luhy had per imsaral a rumil vectohva fohva eyvay triangular facet aynd dust mil villa luh hevel directigu til deciding turxur per rhay luh facet, puud tala des luhy duss mil vu zogu gu luh zerb???
At gue pernmenio ol luh aynswer eu aynvitem visible enn Elite Dangerouss perdeyo. Allo vuvu cleyva.
 
Twifa
Thread Closed: Nuve addayn fohva further replies.
Versi
Luum Tobi